"upgrading" to Vista from XP was the worst mistake I could have made. There was nothing wrong with XP.. I just thought Vista looked cool and would be fun! Wrong!! Not only did I have to buy another stick of ram (2 512's), it was the wrong kind. So I had to exchange it for the right RAM. Then I installed Vista on top of XP (not the clean install but the upgrade). Nothing but problems. The upgrade advisor said everything was hunky dory and ready to go with Vista, yay! But, no. So I re-installed Vista, CLEAN, this time, wiping everything out on the C drive (all my music and pics and stuff are on D which I unplugged just in case). Still having issues. Mostly the screen freezing up, usually in patterns of purple and yellow lines. Or blue screen of death every 15-20 minutes. I'd have to reboot at least 40 times a day. I kid you not. Microsoft technical support was not very helpful (yeah, called them 6 times, they said they didn't know what to do for me). Finally went on here and found some useful info (my video card sucks so thats why it kept freezing up and giving me blue screen errors). Now, evresince decreasing my video card hardware acceleration, its been better but I still get at least one blue screen a day. Maybe I will get a better video card soon if I have money. I have bills to pay, ya know? But for now I guess this will do. Then comes the problem with aero. Thats why I frickin BOUGHT Vista. It looked rad. But then I find out, after MUCh searching, that the reason why there is only the 'basic' vista theme, is because my hardware sucks and my videocard can't handle the aero theme. Well that is just fine and frickin dandy. So how about lets install some third party .msstyles to spice this party up? OH NO NOT VISTA!! Now they are .theme files, not .msstyles files, and you can't find ..Theme files anywhere on the internet. So I am stuck with one, basic, drab, crappy Vista theme all because the upgrade advisor never told me that my hardware would suck and prevent me from having an enjoyable vista experience. Vista, I hereby pronounce you as the worst operating system peice of crap *ever*. I wish I could go back to XP but all I have is the recovery disc that came with my computer. The computer already had XP installed. Crap. Well maybe I'll spend the $100 and get a new copy of XP. I bet I'll be 100% happier. Vista has been nothing but a nightmare and I *HATE* it with a passion. :( Thanks for letting me rant. The end.

Bek wrote:

How much is it worth admitting in public you're stupid! It's priceless!!! Frank

"Bek"

another person that wasted his money without doing any research
Hey next time, just send me the money

I really must protest you calling another person names on this public forum. Most people using personal computers learn as they use their machines. I'd say that Bek went thru a learning experience, but "Stupid" I am sure he's not.
Let's try to be courteous to each other.

My whole point is that you shouldn't HAVE to do research to buy and install an operating system. What if I was a soccer mom or something? Or someone who didn't know ANYTHING about computers? Would I not be allowed to purchase and install something that the billbaords, ads, magazines, tv commercials and newspaper clippings say is WONDERFUL ? Hm?
"Will" wrote:

And I suppose telling you all that I'm a girl is going to make the stereotyping and names worse. Don't freak out though! I live near Redmond! I'll just drive down to Microsoft and strangle someone.
At any rate, whether I am a seasoned computer geek or a beginner, it should not have had to have been this hard. I mean, shouldn't the upgrade advisor have warned me that my video card was a total crap bag? Yes! Alas, it did not.
"Donald Shelton" wrote:

You should be able to use the recovery disk to get back to XP.
Kerry Brown Microsoft MVP - Shell/User vistahelp.ca
"Bek"

True, the upgrade advisor should have told you that your video card would not handle Aero. It wouldn't tell you of all the blue screens, as they are pretty much up to the video card manufacturers drivers... Hopefully an update comes out soon. What card are you using?
Dustin Harper dharper vistarip.com vistarip.com
"Bek"

"Bek"

Your average soccer mom would not upgrade! The average soccer mom would most likely only get Vista when they get a new computer and it comes pre-installed.

Not really... You should do a little research before spending money on something. Especially with computers. Things change so fast, that what works now may be out of date and be worthless in 6 months.
Similar to buying a new hydrogen car in a hillybilly town. Not going to find a station to fill it up unless you go to the big town.
A new operating system will try and be made compatible with as much hardware as possible (more sales$$$), but sometimes it just won't work with the speed and reliability they want...
Dustin Harper dharper vistarip.com vistarip.com
"Bek"

You do not need to buy another copy of XP. Use the recovery disk. It will restore your system to the way it was, when you bought it.

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You should have done your homework and researched the Vista "premium" requirements before you spent your money on it.
Gary VanderMolen
"Bek"

"Dustin Harper"

Nice propaganda page. Maybe in the future every damn thing we own will check in with big brother. Would that make all you MS brown nosers happy?

Microsoft should run ads saying that then, MS is all about having no responsibility. MS Customers are large corporates and larger system manufacturers. There is a small sideline in retail sales. Noone here counts to MS - most are customers of OEMs, the rest corporate clones, or retail customers. Only the last group are MS's customers - really minor ones.
Do you do research on a bottle of beer. Or do you assume beer is beer, it comes in a container, it will be liquid, and you need to open it.
Software is a commodity.
"Dustin Harper"

"Bek"

Well, look... I feel your pain, I do. And... have you been reading this NG for any period of time? If you have, you'd know that many folks find the advisor to be less than stellar when it comes to ID'ing problems. Not surprising, considering the vast number of hw devices out there. I don't believe anyone, anywhere, could write a "stellar" advisor.
I guess we'll have to agree to disagree on whether one should or shouldn't have to do research prior to installing/upgrading/whatever a new OS. I like Vista. I have it running as the host OS on a Dell Optiplex GX620 and I'm writing this in Vista running in a VM on XP (Dell XPS 400).
What I -don't- have is Vista running as the host OS on my XPS 400 because I use this box for TV and video recording/editing. And my TV card does not have, nor will it probably ever have, Vista drivers. So... I did a minimal amount of research before I blindly installed Vista on this box because, quite frankly, I hate surprises. I think it's called "due diligence." And I apologize if that comes off sounding cheeky or smug. I don't intend it to be interpreted as such; I'm not casting aspersions on your intelligence. For real.
Would you download a Linux distro and install it blindly, assuming it would work with all your hardware? Yeah, I know... the advisor told you everything would work. Well, I guess it's too bad you didn't hang out in this NG just a little bit before biting the bullet....
As to the marketing of Vista... well... I mean, c'mon... marketing is marketing. If my mom called me up and said "Hey, this Vista OS sounds pretty cool; should I buy the DVD and upgrade?" my response would be "Why, absolutely NOT, Mother Dear." And here we come to another point...
Some folks have positive experiences with upgrades. Personally, I have done one upgrade... from W2K to XP on a PC I don't have in service anymore. It went surprisingly well, but many others had horror stories about upgrades and my usual modus operandi (?) is to do a clean install. Yes, it's a PITA, but I think it's a lesser PITA than the nightmare that upgrading one's system can turn into.
So, if you're not a soccer Mom who knows -nothing- about computers, then I must assume you know something about computers. And knowing -something- about computers doesn't necessarily put one in the "know enough about computers" category. Again, believe it or not, I'm not diss'in you. I think one of the strongest points one can have in being an IT dweeb is that one should never assume one knows how to proceed. One should always dig around before moving forward. Especially when it comes to moving to a new OS.
This was not written in defence of Vista... the same would apply, as previously intimated, if one were moving to some Linux distro... for real.
Lang

Many linux distros have a live cd. You download and burn the iso (or order it), boot from the cd, and then see how the operating system works with your particular hardware. If everything works, you can choose to install it, or exit, without affecting your current system. You do not have to rely on an adviser. Another nice feature of a live cd is that you can surf the web, or even play a game, while the operating system installs. If after you install the cd, and you feel that you would like to use XP, you can install vmware and run XP in a virtual windows, if you have a licensed copy. It was fun installing XP in its own window, while I continued to use my system. I no longer have to dual boot, since I can turn the usb printer on or off for windows or linux. It sure gives you a sense of being in control of your own computer. Regretfully, microsoft has take the other course. They have restricted the rights that the individual has over his own equipment, as if they owned the hardware as well as the software. With that type of attitude, I will never install Vista on my computer, unless it is in a VMWARE window, where it cannot deprive me of my rights. It would never be my primary operating system.

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In your analysis you make the mistake of looking at technical issues. I would suggest, my learned friend, that the facts of the matter are ! #$%^&*()_ Sorry, I was possessed by a lawyer for a little while. You focus on the technical issues and understand the problems. Tha amazing thing is that an OS works anywhere. But, but, but, these are also used as excuses. And they are excuses that allow MS to avoid responsibility.
Take that ford car in the US that kept burning people to death due to the engineers doing a cost benefit study and concluding that it made sense to accept a certain number of deaths rather than fixing the flaw. I agree with their reasoning. Very smart and rational. But only engineering background people (maybe accountants) will think it's smart.
Ford was unable to mould public opinion on what is reasonable in a car. They suffered.
Microsoft has moulded public opinion. Everyone tends to accept that MS is above the law (and parliments write laws for MS) because they deal with those flakey computer things.
They don't provide the full product. I had to increase my internet connection by 7.2 GB per year at an extra cost of $240 per year to make Vista work (after giving MS $754.95 for it). I also keep offline as much as possible to stop vista uselessly chewing up my 500 MB per month. This month - I had to wait till the 10th before I had enough bandwidth to attempt to download drivers. In the time I've had it I think I'm almost up to a full gig of driver downloads. And it still doesn't work properly (Nvidia).
I also bought an MS lazer mice and keyboard, a week later I bought a logitech optical mouse. I can mostly point with the Logitech. Wireless mouses, according to microsoft, are not designed to be used near RF sources. But that's what computers are, RF sources.
PS the MS Wireless Mouse and Keyboard I was replacing was equally inept. But I thought they had three years to fix it, I had heard, a few days after I bought my first wireless mouse all these great improvments in the product. The Lazer I bought in Jan wouldn't move the mouse pointer till the mouse was being moved fast enough. It could take 5 minutes to get the pointer over the close button of a window. Because it just overshoots anyrthing one aims at. The logitech works perfectly 95% of the time then starts chucking a fit which smashing into the table fixes it.
It's been three and a half years since I could type or point and click properly. The logitech, while heaps better than all my MS mouses, isn't perfect. The logitech works perfectly 95% of the time then starts chucking a fit which smashing into the table fixes it (dunno if it's causal - I've always talked to machines pleading and threatening - empirical evidence says they listen). I still have to hover over things clicking, hoping it will accept my click. I have to edit everything I type to replace all the missing letters it missed (MS keyboard).
Take the web sites of newspapers. The two I read both refresh pages every 5 minutes. So I rarely get to read the end of a story. No one is responsible for pages that disapper while you read them. I, and I've been doing it for years, shut down all other windows on that site. Either my fellow citezens are slime balls prepared to put up with abuse like this or they never analyse their server logs (so much for the theory of consumer choice - I'm a broadsheet reader - these are the only 2 available).
And here in the newsgroup we accept MS's assertion that it is difficult and we can't expect better.
But the LAW is says different. But MS propaganda, the way the structured the industry they control (OEM manufacturers), and the retailers lead to all diffused responsibility. Not a single computer thing in the world works properly and noone is responsible. And the people who administer, make, and decide the law buy it and refuse to apply the law to MS.
There are benefits to all this. Hardware is cheap. The OEM, their industry controlled by MS, make little profit. It is all about cheap hardware with the price reduction shared between consumers and microsoft and paid for by OEMs. The whole structure of the computer industry is a MS tax on hardware.
The internet gives MS the excuse to ship shoddy product. "They can download a patch" MS says gleefully thinking at how they can cost shift it to the consumer (my case $240 per year). "Lang Murphy"

So why aren't you in a linux (a toy unix which itself was a toy mainframe - how we used to look down on you with your little toy mainframes) newsgroup. It's funny how your jelousy has turned from Big computers to the micro computer market. What has happened to your OS - you can only rate this mainframe wannabe as a microcompter OS. It used to be mid level.
How come you are top posting. Didn't you take a pledge about that while slaughtering your youngest daughter to Linus.
"Bill"

Boy, are we incoherent. Just follow your doctor's orders and take your meds twice a day. I am not jealous in the least. You can buy as many copies of Vista, as you want. I understand that some of us have strange fetishes. I would never look down upon you. I top post because I have such strong feelings for you. You make me feel ... so strange. I dont have a daughter, but if I did, I would invite you to stay away from her. No offense. You sound a little too kinky for taking out my son or daughter, as the case would be. Sacrificing on altars is just not something I would let you entice my children into doing. Sex sounds rather bland after that scenario. Just remember...Follow the yellow brick road, follow the yellow brick road...
On Sat, 31 Mar 2007 18:07:12 +1000, . wrote:

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You sound like such a controlling person. I should report you to DOCS. Stiffling your non existent children's sense of indivuality and denying them the ability to learn responsibility. Men like you should be in gaol. And I hope you never see these children receive a top award when [not] graduating from uni. I hope you don't get to give away your daughter at her [not] wedding.
Your children are strong. Remove you from their [not] lives and their [not] spirit will overcome the damage people like you do.
It's time for my inner grandmother workshop.
You aren't going to go out dressed like that, are you? When I was young my father died, so I left school at 3 and got 5 jobs and woked 25 hours a day so I could give all my money to my mother so my mother, my brothers, and my sister all had enough to eat. Oh my, you wouldn't do something like that, would you? In our day we had to work really hard. You have it so easy.
[ps sorry for long sentence above. Artistic considerations of paragraph contruction were considered more important. Hope you kept breathing while reading it]
"Bill"

Go and whinge somewhere else,cockhead. Do you want everything for nothing, do you? You obviously could not be bothered reading what hardware upgrades you needed. Stop wasting time and space here!
Mick Murphy
"Bek" wrote:

so you want to blame microsoft and vista because you have a piece of junk computer.
maybe your parents need to change your diaper and put you back in the crib so you will leave the adult toys for the adults.

mikeyhsd comcast.net

"Bek" "upgrading" to Vista from XP was the worst mistake I could have made. There was nothing wrong with XP.. I just thought Vista looked cool and would be fun! Wrong!! Not only did I have to buy another stick of ram (2 512's), it was the wrong kind. So I had to exchange it for the right RAM. Then I installed Vista on top of XP (not the clean install but the upgrade). Nothing but problems. The upgrade advisor said everything was hunky dory and ready to go with Vista, yay! But, no. So I re-installed Vista, CLEAN, this time, wiping everything out on the C drive (all my music and pics and stuff are on D which I unplugged just in case). Still having issues. Mostly the screen freezing up, usually in patterns of purple and yellow lines. Or blue screen of death every 15-20 minutes. I'd have to reboot at least 40 times a day. I kid you not. Microsoft technical support was not very helpful (yeah, called them 6 times, they said they didn't know what to do for me). Finally went on here and found some useful info (my video card sucks so thats why it kept freezing up and giving me blue screen errors). Now, evresince decreasing my video card hardware acceleration, its been better but I still get at least one blue screen a day. Maybe I will get a better video card soon if I have money. I have bills to pay, ya know? But for now I guess this will do. Then comes the problem with aero. Thats why I frickin BOUGHT Vista. It looked rad. But then I find out, after MUCh searching, that the reason why there is only the 'basic' vista theme, is because my hardware sucks and my videocard can't handle the aero theme. Well that is just fine and frickin dandy. So how about lets install some third party .msstyles to spice this party up? OH NO NOT VISTA!! Now they are .theme files, not .msstyles files, and you can't find .Theme files anywhere on the internet. So I am stuck with one, basic, drab, crappy Vista theme all because the upgrade advisor never told me that my hardware would suck and prevent me from having an enjoyable vista experience. Vista, I hereby pronounce you as the worst operating system peice of crap *ever*. I wish I could go back to XP but all I have is the recovery disc that came with my computer. The computer already had XP installed. Crap. Well maybe I'll spend the $100 and get a new copy of XP. I bet I'll be 100% happier. Vista has been nothing but a nightmare and I *HATE* it with a passion. :( Thanks for letting me rant. The end.

Glad your rant is over. Vista sucks because everything you did is wrong - beginning with installing Vista on a computer that could not handle it.

"Bek"

"Will"

Define "research".
Does using the Upgrade Advisor and MS's HCL (Hardware Compatibility List) count? I did both, and still wound up with a video card, sound card, modem & card reader all rendered useless when both forms of "research" claimed they were fine.
I had one MVP here go so far as to tell me that the UA "never actually claimed my hardware would work right NOW, but rather it MIGHT in the future." <snicker>
I'm still looking for that detail in the instructions, since it must be in there, ...right?
gotta love MS Marketing.

======================================= "If you can't make it good, at least make it look good." - Bill Gates =======================================

Hi Bek, I live in washington (olympia) as well.
To be honest the upgrade advisor exists to warn of incompatibilities.
It's not designed to find faulty hardware or deal with poor drivers from 3rd party manufacturers.
If you're having hardware issues Vista is hardly to blame.

"Bek"

Richard Urban wrote:

Cheers.